by several, and thus referring to Cyprianus. But the vicar demanded that one should record the words of Master Ulrich, because he believes he may catch him in small matters, for Master Ulrich may not have been very careful in the use of his words. Therefore he also demands that a copy of Cyprianus should be brought, so that the dispute may be decided. But the vicar said: Supposing the words of Cyprianus are as I think, and not as you? And thereupon a quarrel arose, which had naught to do with the questions which the vicar had been called upon so often to answer. Therefore I have not taken pains to remember and note this. But if I understood the matter both were right. For Zwingli referred to those who had been baptized by heretics, who should, according to Cyprianus, be baptized again in the churches, which several thought was needless. But the vicar was speaking of those who once baptized by Christians had gone over to heresy and later on wished to reenter the Christian Church; these did not need another baptism, but merely absolution by the imposition of hands, etc. Several were, however, also opposed to this, as Cyprianus writes in his letters to Pompeius and to Quintinus.
After there had been considerable talk concerning this matter, Dr. Sebastian Hofmann,* of Schaffhausen, a member of the order of the Barefoot Monks, spoke thus: Learned, spiritual, honor- * He was properly called Sebastian Hofmeister, or in the scholastic form Oikonomos. Because his father was a ‘‘ wagner,’’ z. e., wheelwrignt, he was himself erroneously called Wagner, or in Latinized form Carpentarius. He was born at Schaffhausen in 1476; entered the Barefoot (Franciscan) monks there; studied in Paris the classical tongues and Hebrew, and came home in 1520 as a Doctor of the Sacred Scriptures, and the same year he taught in the Franciscan monastery in Zurich and so came in contact with Zwingli. He embraced the Reformation, and introduced it into Lucerne and into Schaff- hausen (both 1523), whither persecution drove him. It is indeed as the Re- former of Schaffhausen that he is best remembered, yet his career there was brief, for in 1525 he had to leave that city. He preached in Zurich (1526) and taught Hebrew in Bern (1528), but died September 26, 1533, as preacher at Zofingen, thirty miles sontheast of Basel. Two of his writings were com- monly attributed to Zwingli.
y : ft en yoni THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. 79 able, wise, favorable, gracious, dear gentlemen, it is necessary that I also speak in this matter. Last year I was lector at Lucerne, where, according to my best knowledge and belief, I preached, as I hope and know, nothing else except the word of God from the Scriptures, and in these sermons at Lucerne I have mentioned, like many others, the many useless customs of inter- cession and invoking of the saints and the mother of God, and I taught in accordance with the contents and teachings of the holy Scriptures. On account of such sermons, made, as stated above, at Lucerne, various accusations against me were sent to Constance, among which was the sermon about the invocation of the saints. I was accused of being a heretic, condemned, and therefore driven out of Lucerne. And now as my lord, the vicar, has pretended before and stated that the appeal and invocation of saints is founded upon the Scriptures and mentioned in the Old Testament, I pray for God’s sake that the vicar, as he was wont to boast to have overcome the priest imprisoned at Con- stance, show the place, as formerly often had been asked of him, Y \ especially since on account of this I have been accused by my gracious lord at Constance of being a heretic, and I will accept it with many thanks and willingly allow myself to be taught in case I have perchance erred in my sermons, have not told the ‚ truth, or have misread or misunderstood the Scriptures.
ZWINGLI.
We know from the Old and New Testaments of God that our only comforter, redeemer, savior and mediator with God is Jesus Christ, in whom and through whom alone we can obtain grace, help and salvation, and besides from no other being in heaven or on earth.
THE VICAR, LAUGHING.
I well know that Jesus Christ alone is the comfort, redemption and salvation of all, and an intercessor and mediator between us and God, his heavenly Father, the highest round by which alone 80 ZWINGLI SELECTIONS.
is an approach to the throne of divine grace and charity, accord- ing to Heb. iv. 16. Nevertheless one may perhaps attain the highest round by means of the lower.* It seems to me the dear saints and the Virgin Mary are not to be despised, since there are few who have not felt the intercession of the Virgin and the saints. I do not care what every one says or believes. I have placed a ladder against heaven; I believe firmly in the interces- sion of the much-praised queen of heaven, the mother of God, and another may believe or hold what he pleases.
ZWINGLI.
ZWINGLI.
That would indeed be a foolish piece of business if one could arrive at the highest round without the lower or without work, or if he were on it to begin at the lowest. Sir Vicar, we do not dispute here concerning how one should appeal to the saints or what your belief is. We desire only that you show us it in the Gospel, as has been formerly often demanded and begged of you.
Thereupon Master Leo Jud f arose and spoke thus: Gracious: careful, honorable, wise, favorable, dear gentlemen, I have been made by you, gentlemen, here at Zurich, a people’s priest and * [““ I said, one may do that. ‘ Must’ and ‘can,’ are they not two different things? The debate was not about ‘must,’ but about ‘can.’ Did you not hear from me about the ladder of Jacob fastened to heaven on which are many rounds? Did you not hear how quickly and speedily Zwingli wished to swing himself up to the cross of Christ? Do you not think if he wished to go to the Lord on the cross that then rightly he would also have found Mary, John and the other people of the Gospel?’ (Faber.)]
t Born at Gemar, near Rappoltsweilen (or Ribeauville), Elsass, thirty miles southwest of Strassburg, the child of a clerical marriage, 1482; studied at Basel; inclined first to pharmacy, but took up theology, and had Zwingli as his fellow-student under Thomas Wyttenbach; M. A., 1506; became deacon of St. Theodore’s church, Basel; pastor of St. Pilt, four miles east of his birth- place; people’s priest at Einsiedeln in succession to Zwingli, and at his sugges- tion, 1518; the same, and by the same influence, at St. Peter’s, Zurich, 1522; coadjutor of Zwingli and Bullinger, particularly remembered as principal trans- lator of the Zurich Bible; died in Zurich, June 19, 1542.
THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. y 81 pastor, perhaps unwisely, in order to proclaim to you the word of God, the Gospel of Christ, which I shall try to do according to my best capabilities, in as far as the grace of God will assist me and the Holy Ghost aid me. But surely now many ordinances of man have been retained from long habit in the churches, and have intermingled with the Gospel, so that the clergy frequently have preached and commanded their keeping equally with the Gospel: yet I now declare that I shall not obey such human ordinances, but shall present and teach from love the joyful and pure Gospel, and whatever I can really prove from the Scriptures, regardless of human ordinance or old traditions, since such human ordinances, decreed by pope or bishop, have been here recognized and proved to be by the Articles * emanating from Master Ulrich to be entirely opposed to the Gospel and truth, and still there is no one here who desires or is able to say anything truthful or fundamental against him. And so although my Sir Vicar has pretended to prove and show by means of the Gospel the invocation and intercession of the saints, such has no¢ yet been done, although frequently requested. Therefore I also pray to hear and to know from him where i it is written in the afore-mentioned biblical books concerning the invocation and intercession of the saints. For perhaps also in my sermons, if God lends me grace, it will be declared and proclaimed that one should invoke to Jesus Christ alone, and only look to him for all compassion, all help, mercy and salvation, which shall be sought and demanded from no other being. Therefore, Sir Vicar, I ‚desire that you teach me if I have erred, and report from the Gospel, showing place and location where it is written that the saints are to be invoked by us or that they are intercessors. Such I shall receive with many thanks, and will gladly allow myself to be taught by you.
* Referring to the Sixty-seven Articles issued by Zwingli for the basis of argument in the Disputation.
82 ZWINGLI SELECTIONS.
VICAR.
Ne Hercules quidem contra duos. Shall I strive with two? That was considered even too difficult for the strong Hercules (according to a proverb of the ancients). Dear Sir, I have nothing to do with you.
Leo: But I have something to do with you.
Vicar: I do not know who you are.
Leo: I shall gladly be your good friend in so far as you desire.
Vicar: That I shall not refuse, for I am not here to become an enemy of any one. If you are then my good friend, as you say, it will happen to us as to Socrates and Solon,* who also through argumentation became good friends.
Leo: Then you have one friend more than formerly.
To prevent such and other gibes Master Ulrich began to speak: Would to God that the saying, Ne Hercules quidem, etc., would be understood and followed as readily by some as it ordinarily is the custom to quote it. Sir Vicar, we desire to hear the quotation concerning the invocation and intercession of the saints, not such useless talk and nonsense.
VICAR.
VICAR.
It is the custom and usage of Christian churches, and is kept thus by all Christian folk confirmed by the litany and the canons missal, *[““Look, how can you say that to excuse myself I quoted in the beginning the saying of Solon, how then it was written by the wise man Solon that when once he was sitting with scholars, who were debating, and Periander asked him whether he was silent from lack of words or because he was a fool, he answered no fool can keep quiet? Therefore I did not refer to Socrates (as you say), but to the saying of Xenocrates when he was one time asked why he alone kept still and allowed all the others to speak, he had answered that what I sometimes said I regretted, but that which I have not said that I have never regretted. Thus it happened, and not otherwise, and as a witness of the truth I cited the proverb: Audiens sapiens sapientior erit. And as another witness Zwingli interrupted the speech by saying that there was no need of fawning and hypocritical style. Now look how you have hit it?”’ (Faber. ) ] Ont THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. 83 that we appeal to the Virgin to intercede for us; this the mother of God herself says in the gospel of St. Luke. Ex hoc beatam me dicent: “All generations shall call me blessed,” and her cousin Elizabeth addressed her in a friendly manner, saying: Unde mihi hoc, etc.“ And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?” Likewise, “ blessed art thou among women,” etc. This also the maiden in the Gospel proves to us, who cries: ‘“ Blessed is the body which has borne thee, and blessed the breasts which thou hast sucked.” [Interruption by Zwingli: We are not asking concerning the holiness and dignity of Mary, but concern- ing invocation and intercession.] We also sing daily: Sentiunt omnes tuum levamen. “All feel thy aid who honor thy mem- ory.”* But since my talk is held to be useless and foolish I will rather keep still.
Thus the vicar kept still and sat down, and then Doctor Martin from Tübingen arose, and spoke thus concerning these matters: Dear Sirs: Much has been said here against the usage and ordinance of the Christian churches which has been decreed and ordered by holy councils and fathers assembled in the name of the Holy Ghost, which, moreover, long has been held without fault as a praised custom and long usage. To oppose and to object to it is a sacrilegious deed, for what has been decreed and resolved by the holy councils and fathers, namely, by the four councils, should be obeyed in Christian churches like the Gospel, as we have written in Diss. XV. For the Church assembled in council in the name of the Holy Ghost cannot err. Therefore it behooves no one to speak against their decrees and ordinances, as Christ bears witness in the holy Gospel when he says: Qui vos audit, me audit. “He that heareth you heareth me, and he that despiseth you despiseth me.” Thus Christ speaks to his disciples and those who in place of the twelve apostles (as bishop and pope) govern the Christian churches; as then the Roman * [‘* Show us that in the Scriptures; the rest is human nonsense.’’ (Bull- inger.) } ry i » A Auf dr { A Ab Nix TA LAS ir “yi A” ie AG gs f L re 84 ae ZWINGLI SELECTIONS.
Church is now since many centuries the mother of all others, which is confirmed by words of Christ, Matt. xvi. 18, 19, as this is explained in Diss. X. and XII., cap. in nova et cap. quamvis. Concerning this there is here talked and quarreled against the invocation of the dear saints, just as if such honest and divine usage followed in Christendom many centuries were not founded upon the Scriptures, although St. Jerome in “Ad Jovianum ” writes much concerning the intercession of the saints, and that this is advantageous to us he proves from the hopeful Scriptures. That we also receive true report concerning this from the canon of the holy mass, introduced by the old popes and bishops, and composed by Gregory and sung in all Christendom, proves that the intercession and invocation of the dear saints and the Virgin Mary is not considered useless. We also see this in our daily experience of miracles which occur everywhere. Consequently it seems wrong to me to consider and value such as useless and contrary to the Scriptures, etc.
ZWINGLI.
ZWINGLI.
The good gentleman also intervenes and urges much in favor of the ordinances and usage of the Church, the fathers and councils gathered together and inspired by the Holy Ghost, and thinks one should not speak against them, etc. I say he will by no means prove that the councils have all been gathered in the name of the Holy Ghost for the purpose of all the ordinances which they made, since it has been proved before that they often have decreed contrarily, and have resolved upon, done and rescinded one thing to-day, to-morrow another, although the Holy Ghost is at all times alike, and does not oppose his decision once rendered. But when he says what has been decreed by councils and fathers is to be obeyed like the Gospels, I say what is as true as the Gospels and in accordance with the divine Spirit one is bound to obey, but not what is decreed in accord- ance with human reason. But as to what further than this is to ee THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. 85 be considered by pope or council as a mortal sin we do not think that we are in duty bound to treat that the same as the Gospels; we wish to be free, not to burden our consciences with that. E. g., if pope or council commands us, at risk of mortal sin, to fast, or to eat no egg, no butter, no meat, which God has not ordered us to do, Luc. x. 7; Col. ii. 16, 21, but is permitted and made voluntary, therefore we will not believe that such and other ordinances decreed by the councils are decreed by the Holy Ghost, and to be respected equally with the Gospel. How does it happen that they wish to order us to eat no cheese, no eggs, no milk, but stinking oil, with which they scarcely oil their shoes at Rome, and otherwise eat chickens and capons? But if one says it is thus written in the canons and decreed by the fathers, I say it is written otherwise in Paul, and Christ has given another and easier law. Now do we owe more obedience to God or the Holy Ghost, or to human beings? Acts v. 32. But when he declares the Church has decreed such, she cannot err, I ask what is meant by “Church?” Does one mean the pope at Rome, with his tyrannical power and the pomp of cardinals and bishops greater than that of all emperors and princes? then , I say that this Church has often gone wrong and erred, as every one knows, since it has destroyed the land and its inhabitants, burnt cities and ravaged the Christian people, butchering them for the sake of its earthly pomp, without doubt not on account of a command of Christ and his apostles. But there is another Church which the popes do not wish to recognize; this one is no other than all right Christians, collected in the name of the Holy Ghost and by the will of God, which have placed a firm belief and an unhesitating hope in God, her spouse. That Church does not reign according to the flesh powerfully upon earth, nor does it reign arbitrarily, but depends and rests only upon the word and will of God, does not seek temporal honor and to bring under its control much territory and many people Jana to rule other Christians. That Church cannot err. Cause: i VN Jf vs 86 ZWINGLI SELECTIONS.
she does nothing according to her..own.will or what she thinks fit, but seeks only what the spirit of God demands, calls for and decrees. That is the right Church, the spotless bride of Jesus Christ ~ governed and refreshed by the Spirit of God. But the Church which is praised so highly by the Papists errs so much and severely that even the heathens, Turks and Tartars know it well. But when he refers here to the words of Christ, Luke x. 16, “He that heareth you heareth me, and he that despiseth you despiseth me,’’ and then refers this to pope, bishop, regents of the Roman churches, I say that such is not the meaning of Jesus Christ, that we should obey them in all things as they order. For Christ the Lord knew well that such great braggarts would sit upon the chair of Moses who would burden the necks of the poor with unbearable and heavy loads, which they themselves would not touch with a finger. Hence the saying, “ He that heareth you heareth me,” etc., will not serve for that for which the papists and sophists interpret it, but the right meaning is, as is also shown by what precedes and follows. When Christ sent his disciples to preach the Gospel in country and city he spake: * “ Go ye and preach,” saying the kingdom of God is approaching, etc.. And later Christ said: “He that receiveth you receiveth me,” as Matt. x. 40 says. This means they should preach His word and bring it to the people, but not human foolishness and law. For one serves the Lord in vain if one prefers human doctrine and decree. And may the good gentleman furthermore remember what Jerome writes in ad Jovinian concerning the invocation or intercession of the saints that he has not read correctly. For it is written ad Vigilantium; but how Jerome - twists the Gospel in regard to invocation or intercession of the saints, as he does often in other places, that all know who read Jerome with good judgment.* Finally, in regard to the canon {„ *[“Zwingli said that if he were only half a man, stood on one leg and "closed one eye, he would nevertheless yield not to Jerome.” (Faber.) ‘“ Thereupon Heinrich Wolf said ‘such words were never heard from his lips, THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. 87 which is read in the mass, and in which invocation and interces- sion of the saints are referred to, I say one sees readily that the canon has not been made by one alone, but composed by several. For there are many useless words therein, as haec dona, haec munera, etc., from which may be inferred that it has not been made by one scholar. The apostles never celebrated mass thus; one also finds that in several instances the custom of the canon is different from ours, which I shall point out and shortly prove, if God wills it. Concerning the miracles which are done by the saints we have spoken before. Who knows through whom or why God decrees this? * We should not attribute this so readily on account of our unbelief to the saints when we hesitate con- cerning Christ and run to those creatures for help. This all is proof of a weak faith and small hope in Jesus Christ, whom we do not rightly and entirely trust. Why do we flee from Him and yea never thought of during his lifetime.’ To be sure, when you referred to Jerome in regard to the intercession of the saints, he said the argument which Jerome uses there has no basis in the Scriptures.”’ (““ Gyrenrupfen.”) ] *[‘* You have omitted that Zwingli even spoke against the public Gos- pel: ‘when one says that the saints accomplished miracles then the devil has done it.’’? (Faber.) ‘About the intercession of the saints he prom- ises a separate book: ‘the whole heavenly host will be with me, without suppressing Christ, but rather let him be mediator.’ Luchsinger answers: He (Faber) thinks because Zwingli said something about the wrong craze for miracles, therefore no one should remember that any more, and each one think perhaps something has been said about it; it doubtlessly was as Hans Heyerli (Faber) said. The matter is this: Hans Heyerli and D. Martin Blansch, of Tübingen, wished to prove the intercession of the saints by means of the miracles (which has all occurred now in a roundabout manner, for as every one knows they have attacked no article). Yes, the saints have done miracles. Zwingli answered: Miracles are not a sign of divinity, as Christ himself declares, Matt. vii. 22, but where real miracles do occur through the saints God does them himself, never the saints, as St. Peter speaks in the Acts iii. But there occur many miracles by the aid of the devil, so Matt. xxiv. 24: He also accomplishes miracles, and changes himself into the shape of an angel of light. Thus Zwingli spoke, and that fool distorts it thus.’’ (““Gyrenrupfen.”)]
88 ZWINGLI SELECTIONS. / hes seek aid from the saints, especially as we do not recognize certainly from the Scriptures that they are our intercessors?
After this Dr. Sebastian,* from Schaffhausen, a member of the order of the Barefoot Monks, arose and began to admonish the assembled council that they should manage and protect the evangelical doctrine as until now, since there was no one there who could bring forward, upon frequent requests, anything more definite from the Scriptures. But he could not finish; the vicar interrupted and said: Dr. Sebastian, you should keep still and not speak thus. You know well what you promised my gracious master; it does not behoove a man to be so vacillating, to be moved like a reed by the wind; you had not promised that before.
Answered the aforesaid Dr. Sebastian: Dear gentlemen, what I have promised the bishop that I have faithfully and honorably kept, but his people have not fulfilled and carried out what they promised to me; that you may testify what I have said here in public.
After this speech there arose another doctor, lector and preacher from Bern, of the order of the Barefoot Monks,f and admonished the wise council of Zurich, speaking as follows: Honorable, careful, wise, gracious, favorable gentlemen of Zurich, your intention and opinion, published in all places by means of open letter for the aid of the Gospel, pleases me well, and praised be God that you are the people to further and not to obstruct the word of God, and pray God that He will not turn away and cause your wisdom to desert from such a godly under- * Dr. Sebastian Hofmeister.
+ Sebastian Meyer, born at Neuenburg on the Rhine, in Elsass, twenty miles north of Basel, 1465; studied at Basel and in Germany; became D. D.; en- tered the Franciscan order; taught in monasteries in Strassburg and Bern; was a rather violent friend of the Reformation. He accepted Lutheran views on the Eucharist, and died in Strassburg, 1545, after preaching in Bern and Augs- burg as well as there.
\ \ @ THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. 89 ‘ae taking, and that He will give and lend you power and might, j strength and comfort, that you will be frightened by no temporal power, whether of pope, bishop or emperor, but so act in these), aor matters that it will redound to God in the future and your eternal praise. And do not mind that you are a small body and few.
4 } ts fr Ay y L sf 7 do not say this to scorn you, but I mean it thus, that you are not,, Li equal to a whole kingdom and are considered too few to struggle.
against so many nations. Remember that God has always by / {, q i y ar means of the smallest and weakest caused His divine word and will to appear in the world, keeping the same hidden from the great sages of this world. Therefore fear not those who can injure the body; they cannot harm the soul. Do not mind that there are now opposed to the truth of the Gospel bishop, pope fy i and sophists. Thus is it considered by God to make the wise of eo 7 this world ignorant, and cause the truth to be made clear by KS, the simple. Therefore I beg your wisdom to remain steadfast in “ N / the word of God, which I shall also faithfully report to my lords. } of Bern, whose preacher I am, not in the cathedral, but a lector v of the order of Barefoot Monks, and I shall sing your honor and: | praise. Then he sat down again.
After this the mayor of Zurich again exhorts if any one ga to say more in regard to these matters he should do it.
lords, he says, are tired of sitting. It will also soon be time = WW dine.
Then arose a canon of Zurich, by name Master Jacob Edli- I f bach, and spoke thus: xy ia J A a A 1} Now listen, dear sirs: My good friend and brother, Master \ v Ulrich, has before exhorted, in the name of Christian love, all those who have anything against him to speak. Now I have had a dispute with him concerning several matters and sayings, but the same was finally brought by both of us before the chapter, where it was settled, so that I thought it was over and should be referred to by no one any more. But now, since Master Ulrich has exhorted those who have spoken against him so frequently to 7 y ur 90 ZWINGLI SELECTIONS.
step forth in the name of God, I have thought he may mean me also. Hence I say if Master Ulrich desires that that which was treated of between me and him remain in the knowledge of my lords of the chapter I am satisfied, and shall refer to it no more. For the matter is bad and worthless; also I know naught con- cerning Master Ulrich, except as a good friend and brother of the chapter. But in so far as he does not wish this, and urges me on, then I shall bring it before you gentlemen. For there are some behind there inciting and saying in scorn one dare not speak. ZWINGLI.
Dear sirs: I had earnestly resolved to call all those here three times by name who have accused me of being a heretic and the like, but I had really forgotten it now, and furthermore I would never have thought of the good gentleman, Masteı Jacob Edlibach. It is simply this, I did treat with him concerning a matter before the prior and chapter, which I did not think necessary to bring, indeed would never have thought of bringing forward here. But since he himself, uncalled for, arises and desires to refer to and settle the matter here, I am well satisfied.
MASTER JACOB.
It is of no consequence. I came to Master Ulrich’s house and he satisfied me, and although not entirely, still I am satisfied. I know nothing concerning him, except all good. I consider him a good gentleman and brother, hence if he wishes to leave matters as they have been settled before the prior and chapter, I am entirely content.
ZWINGLI.
You may well refer to it here; I am well satisfied, and I had rather have it before these gentlemen, since you yourself reported it.
But there were several there, perhaps relatives of the afore- said Master Jacob, who said and thought that Master Ulrich THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. gt ought to act more politely, since one had scarcely incited Master Jacob to speak.
To this Master Ulrich answered that he had never thought of the said Master Jacob, nor would it have occurred to him that he should speak concerning this, etc.
Thus there arose a dispute; some of the councilors wanted the matter to be settled before the chapter, since it had been com- menced there; the others thought that it should be tried in the presence of the scholars and gentlemen; but finally the matter was no more thought of and thus quieted, perhaps left to the _ chapter and thus remained unreferred to. This I report (although not serving much to the purpose) that I may not be accused of not understanding and refuting all speeches and op- position which occurred at that time.* *{‘* How could you say truthfully that you have reported and under- stood all speeches and rebuttals, when I show to you that you have wronged not only me, but others, also Zwingli. You have omitted from my state- ments two quotations, with their additions, Matt. xxviii. 20: ‘I am with you,’ etc., and John xiv. 16: ‘I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter,’ etc. Do you know now what I said thereupon? Since the appealing to the saints has gone on, also the mass has been held as a sacrifice throughout the whole of Christendom, not only now for a thousand, but for thirteen and fourteen hundred years, and if it were not true or right- eous, then Christ would have wickedly forgotten us and the eternal truth; yes, he would have badly kept his word. But he has said: Behold this is a mys- tery; nor has he also said: Only after 1000 or 1200 years shall I first come again to my bride the churches. He said: Every day unto the end of the world. And although we did not heed these words of Christ, regardless of the fact that his words are everlasting, according to Isaiah, and he alone is the truth, and furthermore cannot lie, according to St. Paul, and he is the one whom St. John calls the faithful and true, and sooner will heaven and earth perish rather than his words, still we would have the other promise of the Holy Ghost, who, it has been promised, will remain with us unto eternity.
Hence I do not in great affairs carelessly leave or desert from the Church, but I entrust that rather to Christ. Now what I report has been kept by the Church for so many centuries, hence I would be very careful, since the two things in regard to the saints and the mass are not contrary to the Gospel, and 92 ZWINGLI SELECTIONS.
Afteı this the mayor of Zurich permitted every one who did not belong to the council to go to his lodging and dine, until further request, for it was now approaching noon. But the councilors the aforesaid mayor ordered to remain, perhaps to consult further concerning this.* Thus they arose, and many of the strangers went to their lodging. This much was done in the forenoon.
After all had eaten they were told to appear again in the city hall to hear the decision made by the wise council of Zurich.t After all had gathered, there was publicly read before the council as is written hereafter: When in the name of the Lord and upon the request of the mayor, council and great council of the city of Zurich, and for the reasons contained in the letters sent to you, you had obediently appeared, etc., and when again a year having passed since the honorable embassy of our gracious Lord of Constance, on account of such matters as you have heard to-day, was here in the city of Zurich before the mayor, small and great councils, and when these matters having been discussed in various fashions I also can prove it with the Scriptures, and thus I feel like the honest old peasants: when one wishes to abolish their old traditions and praiseworthy usages, which are not contrary to God, they do not like to obey and allow it. And thus I feel in regard to the said sayings, I trust to Christ and God and the Holy Ghost that thus far they have not deserted us, and I say also agree with St. Jerome, that in regard to these matters I shall rightly hold to the faith which I have received from the maternal breast. Although the doctrine of yourself and your brethren would be very acceptable to me, for I would not be allowed to pray, fast or do other good works, but if I did them I should com- mit a sin, therefore I would probably go to heaven. But since perchance I cannot ask much, therefore I do not wish to lose the intercession of the saints, and especially of the Virgin Mary.’ (Faber.) ] * [‘* Bullinger puts here the word of the mayor: And the sword with which he from Fislisbach was murdered does not wish to appear to fight.’’]
t+ [‘‘ Which has been decided upon in accordance with the debate held.’’ (Bullinger.) ] THE FIRST ZURICH DISPUTATION. 93